Holy Cross

Back-to-back PL champs 2016 and 2017.... but need to get back to relevance in the national FCS scene.
LHFtball
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by LHFtball » Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:48 pm

2 freshman started on O. Why are you all making excuses for the offense? OWL is spot on...lack of development among other things is the problem, not age or experience. The common denominator is quite obvious.


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RichH
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by RichH » Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:57 pm

LHFtball wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:48 pm 2 freshman started on O. Why are you all making excuses for the offense? OWL is spot on...lack of development among other things is the problem, not age or experience. The common denominator is quite obvious.
Kinda missing the point. It is not just frosh. Your pointbis valid but not the sole caufse. 5 starters. returned today. Other 6 had 0 plaing time before today. A new OL coach.to fix an absolute disaster. The 2s had 1 player with any game experience Burbage who missed most of last season w injury. Add in a transfer QB getting his 1st PT in over 2 years.
I dont give the OC a pass. He called the O he wants to run not one these players are ready to execute. Admittedly hard to execute any O behind an OL that was outmatched by Cross front 7.
Go Lehigh TU Owl
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by Go Lehigh TU Owl » Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:34 pm

RichH wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:57 pm
LHFtball wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:48 pm 2 freshman started on O. Why are you all making excuses for the offense? OWL is spot on...lack of development among other things is the problem, not age or experience. The common denominator is quite obvious.
Kinda missing the point. It is not just frosh. Your pointbis valid but not the sole caufse. 5 starters. returned today. Other 6 had 0 plaing time before today. A new OL coach.to fix an absolute disaster. The 2s had 1 player with any game experience Burbage who missed most of last season w injury. Add in a transfer QB getting his 1st PT in over 2 years.I dont give the OC a pass. He called the O he wants to run not one these players are ready to execute. Admittedly hard to execute any O behind an OL that was outmatched by Cross front 7.
I don't understand starting Wilkinson over Shoup given the circumstances. At least go with the senior who's been in the program and has legit experience. Tossing Wilkinson out there given the lack of continuity was a disaster from the start. If Shoup struggled and things started to go sideways then it's time to "see what you got".

I simply fear that things aren't going to get better. I'm totally onboard with using these four games as a "springboard" for the fall. With that said, there better be a reason for optimism in a few weeks. At least if it was a normal spring practice it inevitably concludes with a sense of the glass being half full. There's no where to hide this spring. Everyone is going to know what you got come late summer.

I'm also concerned with the better players jumping ship if things don't show signs of improvement.

Lafayette put up 24 points on Colgate today. We'll see what happens next week. Colgate and Lehigh are both in a similar spot; it's time to be better.....
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RichH
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by RichH » Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:49 pm

Go Lehigh TU Owl wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:34 pm
RichH wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:57 pm
LHFtball wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:48 pm 2 freshman started on O. Why are you all making excuses for the offense? OWL is spot on...lack of development among other things is the problem, not age or experience. The common denominator is quite obvious.
Kinda missing the point. It is not just frosh. Your pointbis valid but not the sole caufse. 5 starters. returned today. Other 6 had 0 plaing time before today. A new OL coach.to fix an absolute disaster. The 2s had 1 player with any game experience Burbage who missed most of last season w injury. Add in a transfer QB getting his 1st PT in over 2 years.I dont give the OC a pass. He called the O he wants to run not one these players are ready to execute. Admittedly hard to execute any O behind an OL that was outmatched by Cross front 7.
I don't understand starting Wilkinson over Shoup given the circumstances. At least go with the senior who's been in the program and has legit experience. Tossing Wilkinson out there given the lack of continuity was a disaster from the start. If Shoup struggled and things started to go sideways then it's time to "see what you got".

I simply fear that things aren't going to get better. I'm totally onboard with using these four games as a "springboard" for the fall. With that said, there better be a reason for optimism in a few weeks. At least if it was a normal spring practice it inevitably concludes with a sense of the glass being half full. There's no where to hide this spring. Everyone is going to know what you got come late summer.

I'm also concerned with the better players jumping ship if things don't show signs of improvement.

Lafayette put up 24 points on Colgate today. We'll see what happens next week. Colgate and Lehigh are both in a similar spot; it's time to be better.....
+1.
LHFtball
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by LHFtball » Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:18 am

RichH wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:57 pm
LHFtball wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:48 pm 2 freshman started on O. Why are you all making excuses for the offense? OWL is spot on...lack of development among other things is the problem, not age or experience. The common denominator is quite obvious.
Kinda missing the point. It is not just frosh. Your pointbis valid but not the sole caufse. 5 starters. returned today. Other 6 had 0 plaing time before today. A new OL coach.to fix an absolute disaster. The 2s had 1 player with any game experience Burbage who missed most of last season w injury. Add in a transfer QB getting his 1st PT in over 2 years.
I dont give the OC a pass. He called the O he wants to run not one these players are ready to execute. Admittedly hard to execute any O behind an OL that was outmatched by Cross front 7.
The point is that kids have to perform. It’s that simple. Look around college football. Young kids excel...for some reason it’s an excuse at Lehigh.
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van
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by van » Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:36 am

LHFtball wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:18 am
RichH wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:57 pm
LHFtball wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 8:48 pm 2 freshman started on O. Why are you all making excuses for the offense? OWL is spot on...lack of development among other things is the problem, not age or experience. The common denominator is quite obvious.
Kinda missing the point. It is not just frosh. Your pointbis valid but not the sole caufse. 5 starters. returned today. Other 6 had 0 plaing time before today. A new OL coach.to fix an absolute disaster. The 2s had 1 player with any game experience Burbage who missed most of last season w injury. Add in a transfer QB getting his 1st PT in over 2 years.
I dont give the OC a pass. He called the O he wants to run not one these players are ready to execute. Admittedly hard to execute any O behind an OL that was outmatched by Cross front 7.
The point is that kids have to perform. It’s that simple. Look around college football. Young kids excel...for some reason it’s an excuse at Lehigh.
so if the OL is performing at their best ability, what is your solution? and Brisson is not an excuse, he is a reason
LHFtball
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by LHFtball » Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:51 am

van wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:36 am
LHFtball wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:18 am
RichH wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 9:57 pm

Kinda missing the point. It is not just frosh. Your pointbis valid but not the sole caufse. 5 starters. returned today. Other 6 had 0 plaing time before today. A new OL coach.to fix an absolute disaster. The 2s had 1 player with any game experience Burbage who missed most of last season w injury. Add in a transfer QB getting his 1st PT in over 2 years.
I dont give the OC a pass. He called the O he wants to run not one these players are ready to execute. Admittedly hard to execute any O behind an OL that was outmatched by Cross front 7.
The point is that kids have to perform. It’s that simple. Look around college football. Young kids excel...for some reason it’s an excuse at Lehigh.
so if the OL is performing at their best ability, what is your solution? and Brisson is not an excuse, he is a reason
Agree. To clarify, it’s not about how many young kids are playing. Young kids play everywhere and it’s not an excuse for poor execution. I think you nailed it!
TMH
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by TMH » Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:14 pm

I spent my entire adult life as a businessman and some principles apply to football and some do not.
So allow me to put you in the position of offensive coordinator of a football team. You are given a lot of very good skill players but your offensive line is stifling production. What should you do?

1.) Recruit better players. The 2nd recruiting class in the Gilmore era is loaded with studs, 2 of them being ranked as ***. Another is considered one of the best guards in PA.
2.) Change Offensive line coaches. We did that this year, replacing the coach who replaced the coach the year before. Hmmm continuity may be an issue but perhaps necessary.
3.) Train the guys you have to work as a strong cohesive uni. The problem is there is only 1 senior in the group and 40% of the OL has never played a snap in college before Saturday. If you had the time, you can drill their assignments over and over again but time is not a luxury at all this year and defenses are developing more and more schemes. I don't know the solution but maybe others do.
4.) Yell at them to play better because other teams are.

Please don't underestimate the value of experience this year in particular. I'm watching a very veteran lacrosse team play right now with a a handful of super-seniors and many, many more with significant playing time. They are operating like a well-oiled machine. Oh to have that luxury.

Listen I'm not holding Brisson blameless by any means. I was a big fan of Drew Folmar who was handed some mediocre talent including a QB with an injured throwing shoulder but over time he adapted the offense to match the skill set of his players and yes, they recruited well. This is where I believe JB's shortcomings lie.
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RichH
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by RichH » Sun Mar 14, 2021 2:25 pm

TMH wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:14 pm I spent my entire adult life as a businessman and some principles apply to football and some do not.
So allow me to put you in the position of offensive coordinator of a football team. You are given a lot of very good skill players but your offensive line is stifling production. What should you do?

1.) Recruit better players. The 2nd recruiting class in the Gilmore era is loaded with studs, 2 of them being ranked as ***. Another is considered one of the best guards in PA.
2.) Change Offensive line coaches. We did that this year, replacing the coach who replaced the coach the year before. Hmmm continuity may be an issue but perhaps necessary.
3.) Train the guys you have to work as a strong cohesive uni. The problem is there is only 1 senior in the group and 40% of the OL has never played a snap in college before Saturday. If you had the time, you can drill their assignments over and over again but time is not a luxury at all this year and defenses are developing more and more schemes. I don't know the solution but maybe others do.
4.) Yell at them to play better because other teams are.

Please don't underestimate the value of experience this year in particular. I'm watching a very veteran lacrosse team play right now with a a handful of super-seniors and many, many more with significant playing time. They are operating like a well-oiled machine. Oh to have that luxury.

Listen I'm not holding Brisson blameless by any means. I was a big fan of Drew Folmar who was handed some mediocre talent including a QB with an injured throwing shoulder but over time he adapted the offense to match the skill set of his players and yes, they recruited well. This is where I believe JB's shortcomings lie.

Well said
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Re: Holy Cross

Post by LUopa » Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:54 pm

I have only followed program since 2018. The year Holy Cross beat Lehigh 56-0...and it could have been much worse. I have seen improve in the program year over year since then. The moral and body language is much better for Offense and Defense. The defense could be one of the best in FCS next fall seeing how we did in 2019 and the HC game. The offense is always behind the defense in every level of football. Let's see how we do against Bucknell and LAF before throwing the baby out with the bath water. We have good talent on offense...let's see if we can get the ball in our playmakers hands a little more next week for Colgate.
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