+50

Back-to-back PL champs 2016 and 2017.... but need to get back to relevance in the national FCS scene.
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mookie
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+50

Post by mookie » Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:18 am

Army favored by half a hundred over Bucknell.


Mountain Hawk
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Re: +50

Post by Mountain Hawk » Thu Nov 11, 2021 5:24 pm

It’ll be as bad as they want it to be
IPSY1975
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Re: +50

Post by IPSY1975 » Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:22 am

This is the Upset Special of the week :lol:
TMH
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Re: +50

Post by TMH » Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:43 am

Current Army HC Jeff Monken is probably the most successful Head Coach at Army since Earl Blaik during the war years of the 40s and 50s. Army is 48-24 over the last 4 + seasons. Ironically he went 4-8 in his 1st season and 2-10 in his 2nd campaign.

West Point was patient.
LUFAN
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Re: +50

Post by LUFAN » Fri Nov 12, 2021 12:41 pm

TMH wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:43 am Current Army HC Jeff Monken is probably the most successful Head Coach at Army since Earl Blaik during the war years of the 40s and 50s. Army is 48-24 over the last 4 + seasons. Ironically he went 4-8 in his 1st season and 2-10 in his 2nd campaign.

West Point was patient.
Monken also brought a 38-16 overall record and a 22-8 conference record in his previous stints as HC. He coached his team to the FCS semifinal 3 times.

Lehigh's current coach sported a 72-81 overall record and was terminated mid-season, in the conference.

Here are some other interesting facts. Monken took over a team that was 8-28 the 3 prior years. Lehigh's current coach took over a team that was 17-18 in the prior 3 years, with 2 trips to the playoffs (PL Titles).

Sorry to blow up your narrative. Keep it real TMH.
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Re: +50

Post by TMH » Fri Nov 12, 2021 3:06 pm

LUFAN wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 12:41 pm
TMH wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:43 am Current Army HC Jeff Monken is probably the most successful Head Coach at Army since Earl Blaik during the war years of the 40s and 50s. Army is 48-24 over the last 4 + seasons. Ironically he went 4-8 in his 1st season and 2-10 in his 2nd campaign.

West Point was patient.
Monken also brought a 38-16 overall record and a 22-8 conference record in his previous stints as HC. He coached his team to the FCS semifinal 3 times.

Lehigh's current coach sported a 72-81 overall record and was terminated mid-season, in the conference.

Here are some other interesting facts. Monken took over a team that was 8-28 the 3 prior years. Lehigh's current coach took over a team that was 17-18 in the prior 3 years, with 2 trips to the playoffs (PL Titles).

Sorry to blow up your narrative. Keep it real TMH.
Are you trolling me? You must have a lot of time on your hands :-)

The 3 year record prior to taking over is meaningless in this situation. The team that Gilmore was handed was 3-8 the year prior. The offense only averaged 17 ppg with 2 All-Americans who then graduated. The only real holdovers were Woetzel, McCloskey and O'Neil which spearheaded a defense that gave up 35 ppg the prior yr and that was their best year. Their All-league punter/kicker was also gone.

This team was left with nothing. It had to be rebuilt from scratch. A new culture had to be implemented, just like with Monken. The current roster is 70% freshman & sophomores. They are the only 2 full classes that TG has had the opportunity to recruit. There is a learning curve, in this case a steep one. Like it or not, I remain bullish for the intermediate term.

As for credentials, you conveniently missed that TG was 2 X COY in the PL and the national Assistant COY. That doesn't make him chopped liver.

I happen to enjoy the discussion if it's kept civil.
LUFAN
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Re: +50

Post by LUFAN » Sat Nov 13, 2021 6:45 am

TMH wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 3:06 pm
LUFAN wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 12:41 pm
TMH wrote: Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:43 am Current Army HC Jeff Monken is probably the most successful Head Coach at Army since Earl Blaik during the war years of the 40s and 50s. Army is 48-24 over the last 4 + seasons. Ironically he went 4-8 in his 1st season and 2-10 in his 2nd campaign.

West Point was patient.
Monken also brought a 38-16 overall record and a 22-8 conference record in his previous stints as HC. He coached his team to the FCS semifinal 3 times.

Lehigh's current coach sported a 72-81 overall record and was terminated mid-season, in the conference.

Here are some other interesting facts. Monken took over a team that was 8-28 the 3 prior years. Lehigh's current coach took over a team that was 17-18 in the prior 3 years, with 2 trips to the playoffs (PL Titles).

Sorry to blow up your narrative. Keep it real TMH.
Are you trolling me? You must have a lot of time on your hands :-)

The 3 year record prior to taking over is meaningless in this situation. The team that Gilmore was handed was 3-8 the year prior. The offense only averaged 17 ppg with 2 All-Americans who then graduated. The only real holdovers were Woetzel, McCloskey and O'Neil which spearheaded a defense that gave up 35 ppg the prior yr and that was their best year. Their All-league punter/kicker was also gone.

This team was left with nothing. It had to be rebuilt from scratch. A new culture had to be implemented, just like with Monken. The current roster is 70% freshman & sophomores. They are the only 2 full classes that TG has had the opportunity to recruit. There is a learning curve, in this case a steep one. Like it or not, I remain bullish for the intermediate term.

As for credentials, you conveniently missed that TG was 2 X COY in the PL and the national Assistant COY. That doesn't make him chopped liver.

I happen to enjoy the discussion if it's kept civil.
1. Absolutely absurd to say that "this team was left with nothing. It had to be rebuilt from scratch". RaShawn Allen is nothing? Haffner, Slater, Norris, Fest, Fornier, Bibbens, Portereal, and more....all add up to nothing?? I am happy to keep it civil, but that is a disservice to some outstanding Lehigh Football players and highly inaccurate.

2. The roster is not 70% freshman & sophomores. It is also not uncommon for classes to see attrition as they progress through. It will be interesting to see how attrition impacts the program moving forward.

3. 17ppg. Is it your opinion that in the rebuilding process a team should digress to scoring just 31 points over a 9 game span? 3 spring, 6 fall. This may have nothing to do with TG and more to do with the offensive coaching. The O has been declining steadily since 2016 and the mere concept of being so bad (123 of 123) that incremental improvement seems promising, is sad for this program.

4. Credentials: TMH, please be honest. There is truly nothing personal about this, it is an assessment of a football coach of a program with all root for. You are applauding a head coach that had a 13-year stint and accumulated a losing record? He was 1 game over .500 in the conference during that span and won 1 conference championship. Maybe we just have a very different idea of "credentials". Bob Chesney has credentials. He came in and took TG's players, that were losing games, and won championships. Chesney is 89-40 with playoff berths in 5 of his last 6 seasons. TG owns a 77-99 career record. Are we really debating this? 77-99 records simply do not cut in D1 football. That is indisputable.

5. Building culture is not TG's expertise. That is no secret among the assistant coaches and former players. I played a Rose Bowl and had the good fortune of playing for great coaches who understood culture. I think it is also unfair to say that the prior coach left the program without culture when this team made the playoffs in 2016 and 2017.

6. I think most are "bullish" that the very worst of this, 15 game losing streak, is behind Lehigh. That said, I'd be surprised to see anything other than mediocrity under this regime.

Prediction: Lehigh gets win number 2 today! TG gets number 6.
TMH
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Re: +50

Post by TMH » Sat Nov 13, 2021 11:40 am

RaShawn Allen is an interesting situation. By absolutely all accounts, this is a young man who will do great things someday. He's an outstanding students, very mature, driven majoring in in electrical engineering, has written two books that were published and is taking full advantage of his Lehigh education.

But I think he learned one lesson in HS. As you mentioned in another thread, RaShawn was either a 2 or 3 star recruit (depending on the service) in high school, specifically in his junior year when he ran for 2,100 yds and led his team to the state championship (the third of 3 in a row). Then his offensive line graduated. Orchard Lake St. Mary's, which runs a wishbone offense goes 3-8. Allen's #s dropped like a rock.

It kind of reminds you of Dom Bragalone. 1st team All-American 1,500 yds as a junior. Then his offensive line graduated. Suddenly he only rushes for 750 yds in 11 games. The other similarity is that they are both North-south power runners which makes the situation worse.

The recent short term success of DiPietro may be due to the fact that unlike most of our backs, he has some wiggle which allows him to find gaps that aren't really there. Just my opinion.
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Re: +50

Post by TMH » Sat Nov 13, 2021 1:42 pm

Ouch...Army nearly covered the spread by halftime
mookie
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Re: +50

Post by mookie » Sun Nov 14, 2021 7:10 am

When does Bucknell fire Cecchini? Army could easily have scored 100.
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