Monmouth

Back-to-back PL champs 2016 and 2017.... but need to get back to relevance in the national FCS scene.
LUFAN
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Re: Monmouth

Post by LUFAN » Sun Oct 02, 2022 3:12 pm

lu90 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 1:38 pm
Richb-3 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 10:39 am Is there anyone here who thinks we do not need a new head coach?

That would fall into 3 categories:

1. Anyone with the last name Gilmore
2. Anyone with last name Brisson (since the only one giving him a job is someone from Group 1)
3. Joe Sterret
+ 1000000


StablerBum
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Re: Monmouth

Post by StablerBum » Sun Oct 02, 2022 6:43 pm

Can you all stop with the Stambaugh crap! High school is not college. It is quite rare to move to the college ranks as a HC from high school. There is so much more to running a college program. No disrespect to Phil, it's just a fact.
I agree with this. Coaching college and high school are two completely different job descriptions. College ball is year round, managing a large full time staff, recruiting, dealing with admissions, academics, fundraising, travel, twice the kids, etc.

Personally, I like the idea of a lower level coach at D2 or maybe D3 level in the northeast/Mid-Atlantic who has shown consistent high level success over 5+ years. Hey, it worked for HC when they canned Gilmore...
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Re: Monmouth

Post by Richb-3 » Mon Oct 03, 2022 1:11 pm

lu90 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 1:38 pm
Richb-3 wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 10:39 am Is there anyone here who thinks we do not need a new head coach?

That would fall into 3 categories:

1. Anyone with the last name Gilmore
2. Anyone with last name Brisson (since the only one giving him a job is someone from Group 1)
3. Joe Sterret
Brisson and Joe Sterrett are rare names. But would not be surprised if there are unrelated LU fans named Gilmore. It is the 714th most common Surname in the USA.

I have no expertise on Stambaugh's situation. Actually I don't even know where he coaches (NDGP????)

I believe the coach Of Cincinnati Bishop Moeller to Notre Dame. Not a great record, but not the worst ND coach.

John Whitehead went directly from Coaching Carlisle HS to Fred Dunlap's #1 assistant. I think he would have now been called the OC. But it was 9 years before he became HC.

The Muhlenberg HC might seem to be the best bet of the other three mentioned, just in that MBerg is more similar to LU academics the DelVal
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Re: Monmouth

Post by Sundayamqb » Mon Oct 03, 2022 9:25 pm

Two thoughts:

1) DI to DIII (prepare to beat me up)? Once upon a time, two sports -- football and wrestling -- were among the elite (say, top 20) in their divisions. The reality is that lately, no sports are consistently among the elite nationally (lacrosse??). Does anyone really think that with the Patriot League handcuffs, NIL, funding issues and an academic profile like Lehigh's, we ever will be a consistent national contender in any Division I sport again?

Sorry to be pessimistic. If we can't compete for national prominence regularly, is it really worth the expense of playing in DI? (I'd like to see someone do the math.)

DII brings its own scholarship issues. The DII today is not the DII of 1977.

DIII -- think Muhlenberg, Wesleyan, MIT, Carnegie-Mellon, RPI, WPI etc. (with no "athletic" scholarships) -- seems like a much better fit if we truly want to remain an academically elite institution. Is that Lehigh's main goal?

If that means wrestling would have to go to DIII, too -- so be it.

2) Stambaugh: I don't know who the next coach should be. Maybe he fits into the following scenario. I like the idea of hiring someone like Monmouth's coach was when hired -- someone talented and younger who will commit to staying through thick and thin. We need a leader focused on developing young people of character and well-prepared for the professional world, parenthood and good citizenship; someone who won't bolt as soon as alumni get upset over a 1-10 season, so long as he is transparent and can effectively communicate the annual goals of the program; and someone who won't bolt for the next head coaching job, but someone who will lure great assistants by building a prolific coaching tree that feeds up-and-coming programs.
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Re: Monmouth

Post by DF2002 » Mon Oct 03, 2022 10:21 pm

Sundayamqb wrote: Mon Oct 03, 2022 9:25 pm Two thoughts:

1) DI to DIII (prepare to beat me up)? Once upon a time, two sports -- football and wrestling -- were among the elite (say, top 20) in their divisions. The reality is that lately, no sports are consistently among the elite nationally (lacrosse??). Does anyone really think that with the Patriot League handcuffs, NIL, funding issues and an academic profile like Lehigh's, we ever will be a consistent national contender in any Division I sport again?

Sorry to be pessimistic. If we can't compete for national prominence regularly, is it really worth the expense of playing in DI? (I'd like to see someone do the math.)

DII brings its own scholarship issues. The DII today is not the DII of 1977.

DIII -- think Muhlenberg, Wesleyan, MIT, Carnegie-Mellon, RPI, WPI etc. (with no "athletic" scholarships) -- seems like a much better fit if we truly want to remain an academically elite institution. Is that Lehigh's main goal?

If that means wrestling would have to go to DIII, too -- so be it.

2) Stambaugh: I don't know who the next coach should be. Maybe he fits into the following scenario. I like the idea of hiring someone like Monmouth's coach was when hired -- someone talented and younger who will commit to staying through thick and thin. We need a leader focused on developing young people of character and well-prepared for the professional world, parenthood and good citizenship; someone who won't bolt as soon as alumni get upset over a 1-10 season, so long as he is transparent and can effectively communicate the annual goals of the program; and someone who won't bolt for the next head coaching job, but someone who will lure great assistants by building a prolific coaching tree that feeds up-and-coming programs.

Lehigh wrestling is routinely ranked in the top 20. In fact, I think we’re ranked top 20 most years.

Lacrosse has been less successful but is rising.

In other sports, we’re competitive.

To relegate all programs because football is over its head? That doesn’t make sense.

And if HC can go from among the worst in FCS to nationally ranked in 4 years, Lehigh can as well.
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Re: Monmouth

Post by Go Lehigh TU Owl » Mon Oct 03, 2022 10:58 pm

Those proposing or at the very least "thinking aloud" about a move to D3 are failing to consider the most fundamental aspect at hand; putting the right people in the right place. Lehigh could move to D3 tomorrow but without an administration, athletic department, coaches, community etc. who are on the same page it will be a failed move. I much rather Lehigh focus on making sure the athletic department is led by someone who values success as the premise of its mission, both athletically and academically. Then hiring coaches and support staff who have the ability or track record of maintaining an institutional standard of success.

Tom Gilmore was a failed hire by an AD who is clearly at the tail-end of his tenure. Did that affect Sterret's judgement? I have zero evidence to even begin to rationalize an answer. Regardless, it has proven to be an egregious hire based on an extended resume of results. What makes it worse, is it was an extremely questionable hire from the start based on performance and character. However, nepotism and familiarity often wins out over prudence. This is an easily correctable mistake with numerous templates in place on how to remove then replace an incompetent coach. Just do it!!

To expand upon the D3 suggestions and institutional positioning in general; this is a topic of great interest to me. I am traveling to Manhattan, KS in early November to meet with representatives from the University of Texas and Kansas State University before/during/after their football game on the 5th. This will provide me with more knowledge as it pertains to institutional positioning related topics such as revenue generation, student-athlete support systems, defining the student-athlete vs employee athlete, NIL, student-athlete advisement relative to socio-economic factors, political/social forces within the state/local community/alumni base which affect institutional decision making and last but not least what it means to be SUCCCESSFUL. Success is what we all want for Lehigh football and, more specifically, the student-athletes who bust their asses to represent it.

My ties to Kansas State stem from professional connections I have established at NDSU (current K-State AD and football coach and other staff came from NDSU) from my time spent in Fargo learning more about the Bison culture. I had a job lined up there prior to Covid. My first Bison game was in 2011 but it wasn't for Lehigh. Ironically, it was about a month prior against Youngstown State which would be the only game the Bison lost that year. The Mountain Hawks beat an 8 win Georgetown team to clinch the title that day but lost Zach Barkett to a broken ankle.

I lived in Bozeman, MT for a few years where I got to know then Bobcat head coach Rob Ash quite well. He provided some great information regarding taking over a program riddled with cultural/ethical issues (like he did after Kramer's dismissal), expectations relative to a bitter rival, recruiting in Montana, friendship with Tavani and moving from non-scholarship Drake to MSU.

Like I said to start, the classification does not determine the ability to succeed. It's the administrators and coaches....
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jimk72
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Re: Monmouth

Post by jimk72 » Tue Oct 04, 2022 10:27 am

In the beginning of Patriot League athletic scholarships I felt the new recruitment rules and roster restrictions were a serious handicap in competing with the Ivies and particularly the CAA. I still do to an extent. But somehow Holy Cross has figured it out, 5-0 with wins over Harvard, Yale, and FBS Buffalo. So has Fordham at 4-1 with loss a 59-52 at FBS Ohio U.

Earth to Dean Sterrett.......Unless there's some sort of financial or other handicap we don't know about..... the problem is the coaching staff...
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Re: Monmouth

Post by ngineer » Tue Oct 04, 2022 11:40 pm

One other thought to consider is whether the PL should continue with football. The other sports programs are generally competitive, but football is the main problem, now, in this country with how the sport has dismantled the concept of the 'student-athlete'. The FBS schools are nothing more than minor league untethered franchises for the NFL.

The current PL schools can each decide how they want to run their football programs, either together in a new league at the D-1 level, and forget the playoffs, just play for a championship; or everyone on their own seek out the division/league they are comfortable with. IF, and I do say IF, the PL schools were starting out today, knowing what we know, now, about the future of 'big time' college football, going D-3 would likely be the route taken. We (the PL) are much closer to Muhlenberg, Dickinson, Ursinus, Johns Hopkins, Amherst, Williams, MIT, Tufts, etal, than the big schools of the CAA, Big Sky, Missouri Valley, Southland, etc. But, I don't see that as a realistic route at this point in time, considering the investments that have been made. The Ivies have pretty much done that with regard to football. They have just gone their own way with the quite group of 8 and add a couple schools a year to their schedules from 'outside' for a little spice. They have their own champion and are satisfied with that. Granted, the PL crew doesn't have the endowment moolah to prop up their ability to give virtual full rides to most students, in essence, full rides for sports but that is what we are up against now.

I believe the NCAA is quickly running out of time to exist, at least as it relates to football. It is a freaking joke and a farce. Today's culture, at least in the East, is not to go to sporting events, cheer together, and bond as a group. On parent's weekend, I saw more people heading out of the big tent toward the Stabler parking lot, than headed toward Goodman. And it was a beautiful day. Bucknell had, maybe, 500 people in the stands for their game with Laughyette on Saturday. We lament the spiraling costs of higher education, but look at what is being spent on the collateral parts of it! Somethings gotta give.
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Re: Monmouth

Post by LUEngineer » Wed Oct 05, 2022 8:15 am

Talk of stepping back from D1 sports is bizarre thinking due to a bad run for the football program. As mentioned above, Holy Cross & Fordham seem to demonstrate that we can be competitive with the right leadership.

Wrestling has the horsepower this year to return to its rightful place in the Top 10 & is loaded with a stable of talent to maintain that.

Clearly those championing for Chechini over Gilmore didn’t know what they were talking about based on his record at Bucknell. Are these the same people advocating dropping to D3?

Get a life as we can turn this program around just like Wrestling is about to do.

When does wrestling season start????!!
DF2002
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Re: Monmouth

Post by DF2002 » Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:12 pm

LUEngineer wrote: Wed Oct 05, 2022 8:15 am Talk of stepping back from D1 sports is bizarre thinking due to a bad run for the football program. As mentioned above, Holy Cross & Fordham seem to demonstrate that we can be competitive with the right leadership.

Wrestling has the horsepower this year to return to its rightful place in the Top 10 & is loaded with a stable of talent to maintain that.

Clearly those championing for Chechini over Gilmore didn’t know what they were talking about based on his record at Bucknell. Are these the same people advocating dropping to D3?

Get a life as we can turn this program around just like Wrestling is about to do.

When does wrestling season start????!!
+1…. Many times over
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